Thoughts on plastic reeds

I have been following with interest the discussion on the web of the new synthetic clarinet reeds by Forestone. A few days ago, the distinguished Sherman Friedland posted an absolutely glowing review:

The Forestone reeds marks the beginning of a totally new era in the development of reeds, all reeds. It is a new beginning because these reeds are reeds which totally duplicate the feeling and response of cane. It  surpasses any reed currently being sold which is not made from cane which has been grown, harvested and then cut. It does have a tremendous advantage in consistency in that it does not have to  be warmed up and soaked. . . .

What this means is that it is just a matter of time before cane reeds as such, become obsolete.

In the same post, Mr. Friedland discusses the new Légère “Signature” reeds, which he finds to be an improvement over the standard Légère, but still not as good as the Forestone. [Update: see my review of the Légère Signature Series clarinet reeds.]

I have not yet tried the Forestones myself, but have used the standard Légères at times, especially for contrabass clarinets. For the very large clarinets, I had a great deal of trouble keeping cane reeds from warping, even during the course of a two-hour rehearsal; the plastic reeds have a clear advantage in this department.

Forestone, Legere, and a bad-news cheapie
Forestone, Légère, and a bad-news cheapie

In my high school marching band days, I was required to use an inexpensive, brittle plastic saxophone reed. In my opinion, these are not suitable for professional playing. Neither are the plastic oboe or bassoon reeds currently on the market.

I do think it likely that, within my lifetime, I will see plastic single reeds take over in a big way. I expect there will be a few purists who will insist on cane, despite its obvious shortcomings, claiming that nothing sounds like good, old-fashioned cane. I think this blindfold test from Légère shows that plastic definitely can sound very much like cane, and will likely be indistinguishable very soon.

The advantages of quality synthetic reeds could be many:

  • consistency from reed to reed
  • consistency of one reed from day to day
  • no need to soak
  • longevity
  • significant reduction in long-term reed expenses

While the advantages of good plastic reeds could be huge for clarinetists and saxophonists, the stakes are even higher for oboists and bassoonists—but the challenges are also much greater. As I see it, there are two major reasons why quality plastic double reeds are still a long way off:

  1. Double reeds are too individual and personal. Single reed players have mostly adapted to using a few major brands of mass-produced cane reeds, but serious double reed players always make their own. One bassoonist’s reeds are very different from another’s, but it’s not at all surprising to find two clarinetists who use the same make, model, and strength. What this means is that synthetic single reeds can, theoretically, be manufactured to feel and sound very much like a reed that is already popular among a large number of clarinetists or saxophonists, but even a very good plastic double reed will likely feel foreign to an oboist or bassoonist. I think oboists and bassoonists could successfully adapt to using these (so-far-imaginary) reeds, but widespread acceptance would be slow.
  2. Soaking plays a different role with double reeds than with single reeds. With a single reed, the object moisture-wise is to get the reed soaked while changing its shape as little as possible—so a reed that is flat on the back stays flat on the back. This is one reason that a plastic single reed is a great idea. Double reeds, though, need to “warp” a little when soaked; a reed that is too dry will have an opening that is too small. So the mechanics of a plastic double reed, which presumably does not respond to soaking, are a little different. Perhaps not impossible, but surely more complicated.

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    Woodwind Doubler Census results, part 3: education and training

    More results from the Great Woodwind Doubler Census of 2011. Enjoy!

    Education and training

    Q: Which of these have been part of your education on woodwind instruments?

    Out of 187 total respondents, every one answered this question. The complete wording of the possible responses was as follows:

    • school band/orchestra program (high school or younger)
    • private lessons outside of school
    • summer camps, workshops, or other formal programs outside of school
    • university band/orchestra program
    • university/conservatory bachelors degree with concentration(s) in multiple woodwinds
    • university/conservatory bachelors degree with single-instrument or other music concentration
    • university/conservatory masters degree with concentration(s) in multiple woodwinds
    • university/conservatory masters degree with single-instrument or other music concentration
    • university/conservatory doctoral degree with concentration(s) in multiple woodwinds
    • university/conservatory doctoral degree with single-instrument or other music concentration
    • other university/conservatory music degree or certification
    • self-taught on one or more instruments

    The biggest surprise to me was the number claiming bachelors degrees in multiple woodwinds. I assume that many of these must be double majors or other oddities, since there are very few true bachelors degree programs in multiple woodwinds available.

    Read More “Woodwind Doubler Census results, part 3: education and training”

  • Woodwind Doubler Census 2021 results, part 3: training/education

    Thanks to all who participated in my 2021 woodwind doubling survey, and to those who helped spread the word. I’m releasing the results in installments, so be sure to use my social media links, RSS feeds, etc. to keep up.

    I got 284 responses, an improvement over 2011’s 187. The numbers for each of these questions don’t necessarily add up to exactly that number, since not everybody responded to every question.

    Which was your first instrument, among the major woodwinds?

    2021 Data
    flute 37 13%
    oboe 13 5%
    clarinet 106 38%
    bassoon 6 2%
    saxophone 119 42%
    none of these apply 1 ~0%

    2011 Data
    flute 22 12%
    oboe 10 5%
    clarinet 77 41%
    bassoon 5 3%
    saxophone 73 39%

    Which of these have been part of your education on woodwind instruments?

    2021 Data
    school band/orchestra program (high school or younger) 262 93%
    private lessons outside of school 248 88%
    summer camps 188 67%
    university band/orchestra program 241 85%
    university/conservatory bachelors degree with formal concentration(s) in multiple woodwinds 27 10%
    university/conservatory bachelors degree with single-instrument or other music concentration 182 65%
    bachelors-level study on secondary instrument(s), but not as part of a formal multiple-woodwinds program 111 39%
    university/conservatory masters degree with formal concentration(s) in multiple woodwinds 35 12%
    university/conservatory masters degree with single-instrument or other music concentration 75 27%
    masters-level study on secondary instrument(s), but not as part of a formal multiple-woodwinds program 31 11%
    university/conservatory doctoral degree with formal concentration(s) in multiple woodwinds 10 4%
    university/conservatory doctoral degree with single-instrument or other music concentration 24 9%
    doctoral-level study on secondary instrument(s), but not as part of a formal multiple-woodwinds program 6 2%
    other university/conservatory music degree or certification 14 5%
    self-taught on one or more instruments 167 59%

    2011 Data
    school band/orchestra program (high school or younger) 175 94%
    private lessons outside of school 170 91%
    summer camps 131 70%
    university band/orchestra program 143 76%
    university/conservatory bachelors degree with formal concentration(s) in multiple woodwinds 27 14%
    university/conservatory bachelors degree with single-instrument or other music concentration 97 52%
    university/conservatory masters degree with formal concentration(s) in multiple woodwinds 13 7%
    university/conservatory masters degree with single-instrument or other music concentration 37 20%
    university/conservatory doctoral degree with formal concentration(s) in multiple woodwinds 4 2%
    university/conservatory doctoral degree with single-instrument or other music concentration 5 3%
    other university/conservatory music degree or certification 12 6%
    self-taught on one or more instruments 118 63%

    What factors influenced you first to get involved in woodwind doubling?

    Besides the provided answers, several of you included personal anecdotes of influences including boredom, norms of the early music scene, orthodontia and injuries, career aspirations like instrument repair and studio work, and the Lawrence Welk Show.

    2021 data
    just interested in more than one instrument 202 72%
    required/helpful for a jazz (or other improvisatory music) group you played in or wanted to play in 139 49%
    had or wanted opportunities to play for musical theater 196 70%
    influenced by a teacher or role model 136 48%
    wanted to improve employability 138 49%
    an ensemble you were in (or wanted to be in) needed someone to play a specific instrument, and you were willing to learn it 118 42%
    an ensemble you were in (or wanted to be in) didn’t include the instrument you already played and you needed to learn another 46 16%
    your training/experience as a teacher required you to branch out 56 20%

    2011 Data
    just interested in more than one instrument 40
    required/helpful for a jazz (or other improvisatory music) group you played in or wanted to play in 37
    had or wanted opportunities to play for musical theater 35
    influenced by a teacher or role model 23
    wanted to improve employability 19
    an ensemble you were in (or wanted to be in) needed someone to play a specific instrument, and you were willing to learn it 19
    your training/experience as a teacher required you to branch out 9

    What sources have you used to learn about or otherwise engage with woodwind doubling?

    Besides the provided answers, nine of you wrote in something to the effect of “lessons” or “teachers,” which I didn’t include as an option because I covered formal training in other questions. A few of you also wrote in “YouTube,” which I have lumped in with “social media sites.”

    Thanks again for your participation and stay tuned for more survey results.

  • Raphael Sanders: Doubling the clarinets

    A few tips on doubling on various sizes of clarinets, from Raphael Sanders, clarinet professor at SUNY Potsdam.

  • FAQ: Practicing schedule

    Some of the questions I am asked most frequently about woodwind doubling are about how I practice. Specifically, how often do I get to each instrument, and how do I divide up my time?

    The truth is that there isn’t an ideal solution, and maybe not even a good one. There are only so many hours in the day. The best, say, clarinet players are spending a good number of those practicing the clarinet. If I practice the same number of hours, but I’m dividing that time among multiple instruments, then I’m likely to feel a bit behind. This is the big obstacle to fine woodwind doubling: practice hours are hopelessly divided.

    photo, Jon Delorey
    photo, Jon Delorey

    Sure, there are ways of improving your practicing efficiency, but the best single-instrumentalists are using those same approaches. And any cross-training effect is minimal at best for players who are beyond the beginner level. If you want to sound like a serious player on your secondary instruments, you have to put in the hours on those instruments.

    Realistically, an embarrassing amount of my practicing is triage: which instrument needs to sound passable to get through the next performance? But when I have the luxury, I like to organize a little better.

    For me it generally isn’t useful to squeeze too many instruments into one day, since the time allotted to each instrument gets too short to be productive. So, if I am trying to practice five instruments about equally and can find about three hours per day to practice, I might decide to practice three instruments per day, for an hour each. But if I rotate through the instruments too fast, different ones each day, I’m not able to reinforce my improvements enough to make them permanent. So I usually settle into something like this:

    Day 1 Day 2 Day 3 Day 4 Day 5 Day 6
    flute
    oboe
    clarinet
    oboe
    clarinet
    bassoon
    clarinet
    bassoon
    saxophone
    bassoon
    saxophone
    flute
    saxophone
    flute
    oboe
    start again…

    In that example, I practice each instrument three days in a row, then neglect it for two. That balance, for me, seems to be a reasonable compromise. If I want to rotate but I feel like a certain instrument needs extra attention, I might assign it two blocks of time on the days it appears in the rotation, and adjust the other instruments around it.

    When organizing your own practice time, you should be asking yourself some questions about your own priorities: How many instruments are you practicing? Are you trying to bring them to a uniform level of proficiency, or do you have primary and secondary instruments? Do have instruments that are “behind” and need extra time for catching up? Does it make sense for you to devote separate blocks of time to (for example) flute and piccolo, or will you fit them within a single block?

    Practice smart, and keep at it.

  • A woodwind player’s introduction to: Native American flutes

    There are many Native American flute traditions, but the one commonly called the “Native American flute” today is the endblown Lakota-style flute, native to the Dakotas.

    • It is a duct- or fipple-type flute, which means it easily produces sound, like a recorder or pennywhistle, though the construction is different.
    • Many of the commercially-available flutes are labeled as Native-American-“style” flutes, which has to do with US laws about who can and can’t sell products as “Native American.”
    • Many Native American “flutes” are sold as decorative or souvenir items, and not suitable for serious playing. My best recommendation is for the Butch Hall “concert” flutes (which I’ve reviewed previously). They are relatively simple in appearance (though beautifully crafted); some other makers’ flutes are highly-decorated, which does not guarantee high instrument quality.
    • Modern NAFs generally have five or six finger holes. The five-holed flutes usually produce a minor pentatonic scale, and the six-holed ones add an additional note (the major sixth scale degree) plus some additional possibilities for cross-fingerings. Playing chromatically requires skillful half-holing in addition to cross fingerings, and these instruments really are better suited to mostly-pentatonic-type melodies. Most high-quality flutes are capable of playing over one octave but less than two.
    • F-sharp minor and G-minor are common keys for solo playing, though many keys are available. If you need to play with Western-tuned instruments, you may wish to double-check before purchasing that a flute is tuned to your preferred pitch standard, as they are not tunable.
    • There’s no surviving authentic ancient repertoire for these instruments; they are thought to have been mostly used for improvisation. (Prior to the influence of Western musicians, these instruments likely did not adhere to Western-type scales anyway; some were built with hole spacing based on the player’s hand size.) There is some modern (post-1970) repertoire for the instrument, most notably the compositions of R. Carlos Nakai (who is also probably the modern instrument’s best-known performer; also check out Grammy winner Mary Youngblood).
    • There is some consensus for notating NAFs in the key of written F-sharp minor, and treating flutes in other keys as transposing. Nakai uses a kind of tablature notation system that closely resembles this, but is intended to use lines and spaces on a Western staff to express fingerings rather than pitches, so it can be used to notate for flutes with atypical tunings.
    • The Nakai school of playing often incorporates bird- and animal-like sounds, including chirps at the beginnings and ends of notes produced by sudden bursts of air. (The required airflow for “standard” tone is low compared to modern Western woodwinds.) Vibrato, trills and tremolos, double- or flutter-tonguing, pitch inflections and portamenti, and grace notes are also common. Digital delay effects are commonly used to suggest the flute echoing against canyon walls.
    • The only traditional ensemble for a NAF is pairing with a Native American drum, but NAFs are commonly played solo, or in New-Age-type settings.
    • Native American flutes, like most fipple flutes, generally respond well to a low, open voicing, though the tone aesthetic is broad enough to potentially accommodate other approaches.

  • A minimal Little-Jake electric bassoon setup

    Disclosure: As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases, at no cost to you.

    Be sure to check out my recent interview with Trent Jacobs, the inventor of the Little-Jake bassoon/woodwind pickup.

    During the past year I got myself a Little-Jake to experiment with some electrified bassoon playing. I didn’t know much about using electronics in this way, and it took some research and trial-and-error to figure out exactly what I needed to use the Little-Jake with my bassoon. I thought others might find it useful to see that information all in one place. Here’s a kind of minimum setup:

    • A bocal that you’re willing to have altered. I had an old one that I liked but wasn’t using much.
    • The bocal needs a small hole drilled in it and an adapter soldered to it. A skilled instrument technician can probably make you an adapter from scratch, or you can buy one pre-made. Forrests Music has one, and so does Midwest Musical Imports. I bought Forrests’s (cheaper) version, plus the threaded plug in case I want to use the bocal without the Little-Jake. I shipped my bocal to Forrests and they installed the adapter for a very reasonable fee.
      Brass adapter visible just above whisper key pip

      Adapter with plug
    • The Little-Jake pickup. It’s a thin cable with a 1/4″ plug on one end, and a little threaded connector on the other. The threaded end connects to the adapter on your bocal.
    • A preamp. The 1/4″ end of the Little-Jake connects to the preamp’s input jack. The preamp works some electrical magic to get the electronic “signal” ready for amplification. You can buy an inexpensive one made from an Altoids tin, or this L. R. Baggs one that Trent recommends, or there are other options if you know what you’re doing. The L. R. Baggs is handy because it clips to your belt and provides a volume control.
    • An audio cable, like the ones used for electric guitars. One end plugs into your preamp’s output jack.
    • An amplifier. The other end of the audio cable plugs into an input jack on the amplifier. There are many options at many price points. I use a small Mackie PA system for practicing or small venues, or a keyboard amplifier if I need more volume. Keyboard amps and PA systems are usually designed for a relatively “clean,” unaltered sound, whereas guitar amps tend to add their own character. This is a personal choice depending on what you want to sound like, but for me the keyboard/PA-type amp seemed to make sense as a starting point.
    Assembled system: bocal → Little-Jake → preamp → audio cable → amplifier (in this case, a small PA system)

    That’s enough to start making some fun sounds, but refer to Trent’s interview and an article on his website for some thoughts on adding effects pedals, which really make things interesting.

    My current pedalboard setup

    The Little-Jake can be used for some other instruments, as well, with the same setup (except the adapter must be attached to a saxophone or bass clarinet neck, clarinet barrel, etc.).

7 Comments

  1. I’ve been playing with Fibracell, for many of the advantages you list. While not as good as a good cane reed, it’s not as bad as a bad cane reed, and it’s ready to go, even if the clarinet or sax has been sitting idle for an hour when I’m doubling.

    Looks like Forestone doesn’t make sax reeds yet, but I’ll definitely keep these on my radar screen.

  2. Interesting… I hadn’t tried Legerre or Forestone. I am mostly playing sax these days.
    On clarinet, I thought Fibracell was very good. And for sax they’re decent- I agree with Geoff’s statement.
    What do you think of Fibracell Bret?

  3. I have been playing clarinet for 36 years and just decided to try a couple Legere reeds after a year of terrible luck with reeds. I have to say – the are bright, play easier than their strength, have very good high range. Not my most favorite in the very low range. Bottom line, I have had better cane reeds occasionally, but these are better than the last 20 reeds I have tried. Double C pops right out. Good attack as well.

  4. After learning about the Legere reeds back in 2006, I have been playing them for both classical and contemporary styles on tenor and baritone saxophones.

    If you are thinking about experimenting with a Legere saxophone reed, I would recommend that you purchase one reed at the same strength and one reed at one strength above the strength you are playing on for a traditional wood reed (A Player Performing on a Strength 3 Vandoren/Rico should try both a strength 3 and 3.25 Legere Synthetic Reed).

    While equipment (saxophone/ mouthpiece/ reed/ ligature) contributes to just a small portion of the overall equation, I’ve found that making the switch to Legere reeds for tenor/baritone saxophones not only saves me a tremendous amount of money (each reed usually lasts me between 2-3 months of practicing 3hrs or more per day) but also allows me to easily transition between soprano (playing a traditional wood reed), alto (playing a traditional wood reed), tenor, and baritone saxophones in the shortest amount of time possible.

  5. I’ve got one of those legère bassoon-reeds, and I’m really glad I have it!
    As a selftought doubler on bassoon, I never got into making or tweaking my own reeds. The legère bassoon reed simply plays, and this helps me a lot. It’s a long time, that I put a cane reed on my bocal. Perhaps there have been better sounding cane reeds, but it always was a struggle.

    On saxes and clarinets, I have cane or legère signatures, depends on the mouthpiece.

  6. I’ve only been playing the alto sax for about 5 years and just recently tried a Légère reed. I love it being ready to go and the first 30 minutes or so that I play, all goes very well. Then, when the saliva builds up under ther reed, it doesn’t respond here and there as I play….no sound…If I stop and clean the reed and reinsert it, it returns to sounding good.
    Is it my inexperience that is causing this problem? I would really appreciate some advice about this.

    Today, after the usual frustration with the plastic reed, I even resorted to going back to a Rigotti Gold reed. After keeping this fresh reed in my mouth at least 10 min. before using it for the first time, it worked well.
    However, I would really like to be able to use the Légère reed all the time.

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